There has been a long running (but friendly – mostly) feud between me and a couple of my former coworkers. You see, they are both Big East fans, Syracuse fans, to be exact.
When we worked together, we used to get into frequent ACC vs. Big East arguments. Obviously, I (and all the other ACC fans around. I mean this is Raleigh) would win every time. That didn’t stop them though, God bless ’em.
We all left the company many years ago, but continued our battles each year when hoops season came around. As you might guess, the fight has gotten a bit tougher in recent years as the Big East finally got good again, winning the last two titles. Of course, the ACC won the two before that.
In fact, those emails were part of the reason why I started this site. I’d put all this time into my responses and then they’d disappear into the ether, only to be read by a few pissed off people. Well, now I’m bringing the fight out into the light.
I got an email this morning, the first volley if you will, sending me the link to an article by some guy (Mike Waters) up in Syracuse who wants to make the case that the Big East is better than the ACC. Better now, this year, even before they add Marquette, Louisville, Cincinnati, Depaul and South Florida next year. Needless to say, the guy’s arguments are weak. I’ll attack them here.
Here’s the article.
First off, let me point out that I don’t think the Big East is bad. In fact, I think it’s a very strong conference and has been for the past couple of seasons. It’s just that the ACC has been pretty damn strong the past couple of years too and promises to be ridiculously good this year. The Big East would be better off comparing themselves to the SEC or Pac 10.
And now on to the article’s shortcomings…
Here are two quotes from the same piece:
“I was on record the last few years that the ACC was better at the top, but the Big East was clearly better top to bottom,” said ESPN analyst and Duke graduate Jay Bilas. “The Big East has been a more competitive league from top to bottom.”
“I thought the Big East last year was very weak from halfway on down,” ESPN analyst Fran Fraschilla said.
Nice editing there. There’s no better way to reinforce your point than to use conflicting quotes from two analysts. To add even further weight to Fraschilla’s argument, this very article talks about how bad Virginia Tech and Miami have been in the Big East. I guess the bottom really wasn’t that good.
Now onto some of the points about why he thinks the Big East is better than the ACC this year:
1. The Big East is deeper. “Five through nine, the Big East is rock solid.”
Well, five through six of the ACC are ranked. In the top 20, no less. Florida State and Virginia, both bubble teams last year, are the next two. I’m not sure how this makes the Big East better.
To rehash, four Big East teams are ranked and another got some votes. Six ACC teams are ranked and a seventh got votes. Which league sounds deeper to you?
2. “The ACC doesn’t have a player from outside its top six teams who will be even second-team all-league.”
Does this mean anything? State is picked sixth in the ACC and Julius Hodge was last year’s ACC POY. Does it make a conference better if the top six teams can’t fill the top ten player positions? In the ACC, it just so happens that the top teams are loaded with potential All-Americans. More on that below.
3. Name players.
Really? The Big East has more name players? 12 of the 50 Preseason Wooden nominees are from the ACC. It looks like the Big East has 8.
4. “The top high school player in each of the last two recruiting classes ยฏ not counting those who went straight from high school to the NBA ยฏ both play for Connecticut. They would be Charlie Villanueva and Rudy Gay.”
Nope. Villanueva was never considered the top non-pro recruit. In fact, the top recruit went to the ACC. Check the rankings. In 2003, the top non-pro was Luol Deng.
5. “The best big man in college basketball might just be Pittsburgh sophomore Chris Taft. The best shooting guard in college basketball, according to CBS Sportsline’s Gregg Doyel, is Syracuse’s Gerry McNamara.”
OK, so he uses Doyel to rank shooting guards, but casually mentions that Taft “might just be” the best big man, without mentioning that Doyel ranks Sean May as the #1 center, ahead of Taft. For shooting guards, McNamara is #1, but 3 of the top 6 are ACC guys (JJ Redick, Rashad McCants and Justin Gray). The ACC also has the top point guard and four of the top ten (Chris Paul, John Gilchrist, Jarrett Jack and Raymond Felton). Julius Hodge is his #1 small forward. To rehash, the Big East has the top SG and PF (Ryan Gomes), and the ACC has the top PG, SF and C. So how do Doyel’s ranking prove Waters’ point? Did he even bother to look at the lists, or did he just google on McNamara’s name?
Ahh, this was too easy. Look, obviously the Big East is very good and has been having a nice run. I don’t question that. But if you’re going to say it’s clearly better than the ACC, especially this season, you better have some real facts to back it up. Facts that can offset the fact that the ACC has three of the top four and six of the top twenty ranked teams in the country.
52 responses to “ACC vs. Big East”
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